No one cares if the fate of the universe is at stake. James Gunn has known that since he was a kid, watching cheesy 70s disaster movies from a worn red seat in the back of his local theater in St. Louis, Missouri. A lot of filmmakers have forgotten it, but he never has.
“I’ve always been fascinated by this, honestly. You’ll be watching this earthquake happening that’s about to swallow Los Angeles, and there will be a dog running through the streets, narrowly avoiding the devastation. And you’ll care more about the fate of that dog than you will all of Los Angeles,” Gunn tells Esquire Middle East.
We’re sitting in Paris a couple weeks before the release of his third Guardians of the Galaxy film, and Gunn is on his farewell tour. He’s got his trademark energy—loud, confident, joyful—but it’s all got that tinge of melancholy that comes before a big goodbye, even if it’s the right one. He’s been made the big boss over at DC, and while Marvel would love to have him back, it doesn’t look like he’ll ever have the time.
Anyway, we’re talking about the fate of the universe because, frankly, superhero movies are in a weird place at the moment. Movie after movie, no matter the studio, is underperforming, and Gunn has an idea as to why. Things have gotten a bit too big.
“They all end up kind of looking the same. It’s a lot of bang, and smash, and every third act leaves the story behind and just becomes a big fight scene. And, I think, repeatedly focusing on ‘saving the universe’ gets a little old, because we all know the universe isn’t going to die. There’s no real stakes in these movies,” Gunn opines.
It’s kind of funny that, in the middle of a string of question marks, Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3 feels like the safest bet. After all, ten years ago, when the first was released, a lot of people thought that it heralded the beginning of the end for Marvel movies, a sign that the studio had run out of A-listers and trotting out D-list obscure names like “Star Lord” and “Groot”, a bunch of misfits only diehards had even heard of, would be met with complete indifference.
The Guardians are now household names, of course. Fans wear the maroon leather Star Lord jacket like he’s the modern-day Indiana Jones, dancing Baby Groot bobbleheads have been likely sold in the millions, and their roller coaster is one of the most popular attractions at Disney World. James Gunn made all that happen not by thinking about the fate of the universe, but by thinking about the dog. He made us care about these people and their problems, no matter how small they may seem.
Nobody cares about the galaxy bit. They care about the Guardians.
“It comes down to James Gunn as a dude, I think,” says Chris Pratt, who plays Star Lord. “He’s an incredibly empathetic person. He cares deeply about people, a lot about animals, and he’s really f***ing weird. He’s a misfit himself, so when he’s creating a story about misfits, he knows the heart of one. He wants to tell the story, and he’s done it the same way since he was torturing his brother Sean in their Super 8 movies as kid.”
Gunn is careful who he surrounds himself with. People that get added into the Gunn fold tend to stay in, and not one of them fit the mold to begin with. Ask, and each one will tell you that Gunn saw something in them that no one else had.
“For years, I would get there, nail the audition, and then get that heartbreaking phone call saying ‘you were the best person that he saw, but he’s going to go ‘traditional’, as if I fit outside of something that is considered normal,” says Zoe Saldana, who plays Gamora in Guardians of the Galaxy.
“James Gunn shared that that feeling that he didn’t belong, that he fit outside the mold of what was traditional. He made his normal, and there was space for me there,” Saldana continues.
Gunn didn’t create his normal overnight. He’ll tell you himself—the man he’s become is the result of a lot of pain, rejection, and self-reflection. He’s even a better man than he was when he made the last Guardians film in 2017, after a cynical campaign online dug up his old offensive jokes from early Twitter and got him fired from Marvel in 2018, all of which dredged mental health issues he thought he’d moved on from. He fought through it, owned his mistakes, and rediscovered his creative voice over at DC.
“I needed to break outside of where I was, because I was not the healthiest person at that time. I was getting distracted by things that didn’t matter as much to me,” Gunn told us in 2021.
At that point, of course, Gunn could have moved on from Marvel altogether. But one story in particular pulled him back—one he needed to finish himself. It was the story of the smallest Guardian of all, a raccoon named Rocket. He’s a character Gunn has always seen himself in.
“Rocket is an angry little guy. He can be cruel at times. He can push everyone away. He’s afraid to be vulnerable. I very much relate to that, through my years of trying to be myself and share myself with other people. But my natural inclination is to feel very cut off from everyone, and to use anger and dark humour and a lot of other things to push people away,” says Gunn.
Gunn calls Rocket the secret protagonist of the Guardians films, and with good reason. In the first, we meet him on the far reaches of space, a surly bounty hunter who trusts no one—covered in scars he won’t explain. He was once an innocent animal, and through genetic testing, was turned into what he is today—a being that can’t see his own strengths because he’s so convinced his shortcomings make him undeserving of love.
Guardians 3 finally tells his story. It’s a story that’s easy to compare to Gunn’s own. In the first and second, he realizes that even with his flaws, people will be able to see the good in him—and that he’s capable of more than he imagined. In the third, he’s at his lowest point, and through the love of his friends he’s able to rise again, and finally fulfill his potential. By the end of the trilogy, all his malice is gone—and only love remains.
“I’m a better person than when I began. I’m better at not letting the noise of everything else overcome me,” says Gunn.
While the Guardians may feel built to go on together forever, Gunn disagrees—this is where it always should have ended. Each character becomes the person they were always supposed to become—even if the journey that got them there was unpredictable. Gunn is happy to close the book he started in 2013. All great stories deserve a great ending.
“I don’t think there will ever be a Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 4. There’s many reasons this group will not be back. There could be more Guardians movies, but it won’t be with this group,” says Gunn.
Is that something he wants to see? Is he willing to let this world grow without him? Absolutely—as long as the next person gives their own heart and soul just as he gave his.
“I think as long as somebody brings themselves to it, and doesn’t just try to copy that style—I think it can be really amazing. And there’s so many directors I would like to do that. And I would love to see it happen.”
Not everyone is ready to say goodbye, of course. Even if he never appears in another Guardians film, Chris Pratt is going to carry on that legacy wherever he goes.
“When kids see my face, I have an impact on them. They smile when they see me. As long as I can, I’m going to use this to make kids smile.”
